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Wish me luck!
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Grummie2
wildreddeer
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Wish me luck!
Some of you may remember the wild caught Rio Nanay angels I got about this time last year ....
http://www.uk-angelfishforum.org.uk/t595-rio-nanays-a-few-others
Well sadly I've not had a lot of luck with these, I lost a couple which simply went thin & didn't respond to worming treatments and a couple more that developed a nasty ulcerous condition which wouldn't respond to treatment. I'm not sure if it was something they were carrying, or something they picked up from some Czech half blacks that I brought in at about the same time. Anyway I'm down to one which I suspect is a female, but so far I haven't managed to persuade it to breed. So.....
...I treated myself to some, allegedly Rio Nanay F1's from a new Czech supplier we were trying out. It's always a risk when buying something like this sight unseen, and it can be something of a lottery as to what turns up. Well, I'm slightly puzzled, but overall fairly pleased....
I received 6 adult sized fish of which this one is fairly typical :-
body shape, the patches of orange colouration and the blue iridescence on the gills, are all very similar to my original wild fish, but what about the missing body bars? One possible explanation would be that the fish have a stripeless gene, but if so this would mean they aren't pure bred f1's. I think more likely that they've been raised in continuous light, something that can also cause broken bars http://www.theangelfishsociety.org/forum/content.php/50-Dr-Norton-Article-Continuous-Light-Affects-on-Patterns
Either way, they give me the the necessary Peruvian characteristics that I want to introduce to some of my lines, if only I can breed them.....
...and that's where the "wish me luck" comes in. A few days ago I put one of my Manacapuru cross fish in with them, and a couple of days later I noticed that it had paired with one of the Nanays, so I popped them in a breeding tank, and 48 hours later they're guarding eggs...
Not the best photo, as I didn't want to stress them with a flash, but you can just see the eggs on the spawning cone, the mother on the right is looking at them.
Up to now I wasn't sure on the sex of the Manacapuru, but her breeding tube was far enough down this morning, and she's much slimmer now, so I can be pretty confident.
I have named the Male Paddington, and the female The Angel Islington or Izzy for short. There's a good number of eggs and they seem particularly large, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed for some Manu-Nanus
http://www.uk-angelfishforum.org.uk/t595-rio-nanays-a-few-others
Well sadly I've not had a lot of luck with these, I lost a couple which simply went thin & didn't respond to worming treatments and a couple more that developed a nasty ulcerous condition which wouldn't respond to treatment. I'm not sure if it was something they were carrying, or something they picked up from some Czech half blacks that I brought in at about the same time. Anyway I'm down to one which I suspect is a female, but so far I haven't managed to persuade it to breed. So.....
...I treated myself to some, allegedly Rio Nanay F1's from a new Czech supplier we were trying out. It's always a risk when buying something like this sight unseen, and it can be something of a lottery as to what turns up. Well, I'm slightly puzzled, but overall fairly pleased....
I received 6 adult sized fish of which this one is fairly typical :-
body shape, the patches of orange colouration and the blue iridescence on the gills, are all very similar to my original wild fish, but what about the missing body bars? One possible explanation would be that the fish have a stripeless gene, but if so this would mean they aren't pure bred f1's. I think more likely that they've been raised in continuous light, something that can also cause broken bars http://www.theangelfishsociety.org/forum/content.php/50-Dr-Norton-Article-Continuous-Light-Affects-on-Patterns
Either way, they give me the the necessary Peruvian characteristics that I want to introduce to some of my lines, if only I can breed them.....
...and that's where the "wish me luck" comes in. A few days ago I put one of my Manacapuru cross fish in with them, and a couple of days later I noticed that it had paired with one of the Nanays, so I popped them in a breeding tank, and 48 hours later they're guarding eggs...
Not the best photo, as I didn't want to stress them with a flash, but you can just see the eggs on the spawning cone, the mother on the right is looking at them.
Up to now I wasn't sure on the sex of the Manacapuru, but her breeding tube was far enough down this morning, and she's much slimmer now, so I can be pretty confident.
I have named the Male Paddington, and the female The Angel Islington or Izzy for short. There's a good number of eggs and they seem particularly large, so I'm keeping my fingers crossed for some Manu-Nanus
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
Wish you all the luck in the world Rob. If anybody can do it you can. I know you will have better luck than I did when tried similar. I know your keep us all posted.
wildreddeer- Posts : 217
Join date : 2012-02-15
Age : 73
Location : Nairn, Scotland
Re: Wish me luck!
Well they're learning, and a lot of the eggs seemed to disappear, but this morning they've got a few wrigglers, so at least I know I've got a confirmed pair.
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
well done Rob, love to know how these progress
bridgegirl99- Posts : 316
Join date : 2012-09-10
Location : Kent
Re: Wish me luck!
Sadly the wrigglers disappeared, and because they started bickering, and I was going away for a few days, it seemed prudent to move them to a community tank. This often seems to help reinforce the pair bond, and they're now working as a team to guard a corner of the tank, I may well put them back in a breeding tank in a day or so.
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
I put them back together a few weeks ago and on their 2nd attempt :-
free swimming this morning
free swimming this morning
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
Lovely. No Easter holidays for you, you'll be too busy on shrimp duties! It will be interesting to see what these two produce.
I'd be saying to them 'Good fish, well done'
I'd be saying to them 'Good fish, well done'
Last edited by Deans_Angels on Mon 30 Mar 2015, 00:12; edited 1 time in total (Reason for editing : I love to edit)
Re: Wish me luck!
Congrats Rob! Looks to be a fair sized spawn; there should be some beautiful offspring from those two!
Grummie2- Posts : 162
Join date : 2012-02-11
Location : Chesterfield
Re: Wish me luck!
Yep, there's probably a couple of hundredLooks to be a fair sized spawn
I certainly hope so.there should be some beautiful offspring from those two!
It's very noticeable how differently different pairs behave when their babies go free swimming, some take them straight to the top of the tank, others bring them proudly to the front, and others, like this pair, keep them right at the back and as hidden as possible. For two weeks they've kept them cooped up at the back of the tank, finally bringing them to the front where I could get a few, half decent, shots this evening. Even then the mother disappeared as soon as she saw the camera. Still here's a few photos of dad with babies, sorry about the algae & snail on the glass, but if I'd cleaned it, there wouldn't have been anything to photograph!
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
second attempt?! Sulking here lol! I'm on spawn 5 and they've still not got it right!
Lovely fish though - good luck
Lovely fish though - good luck
Akasha- Posts : 492
Join date : 2014-07-28
Age : 52
Location : Yorkshire, England
Re: Wish me luck!
To be fair, that's second attempt on being put together in a breeding tank for the second time, first time round saw at least a couple of lots of eggs/wrigglers disappear. This time however they've done a brilliant job, I removed the parents today, nearly a month after the eggs were laid, there must be about 200 babies and they're starting to look like angelfish.second attempt?! Sulking here lol! I'm on spawn 5 and they've still not got it right!
Note: These photos are a good example of why it's important to clean the glass before you start taking photos :-
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
don't they look odd! It's the very first time I've seen angelfish this young. They look more like rams with funny fins at this stage. Very very cute though
Akasha- Posts : 492
Join date : 2014-07-28
Age : 52
Location : Yorkshire, England
Re: Wish me luck!
You'll be amazed if you watch your own grow, each day they change. After about a month, you end up with something that resembles an angelfish. I think it's better to see them with parents, but the development is similar. How do a few brine shrimp fuel such a change? when you think about what happens it's quite mind blowing. I'm sure everyone has that 'wow' moment.
Re: Wish me luck!
I agree, the only problem is that the young tend to nibble at the parent's fins, there comes a point when the parents have had enough! Still I kept the parents with them for nearly a month!I think it's better to see them with parents
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
Looking great Rob well done
bridgegirl99- Posts : 316
Join date : 2012-09-10
Location : Kent
Re: Wish me luck!
Getting bigger.....
I'm hoping that the yellow colouration between the black bands is a good indication of good body colour when they're older.
I'm hoping that the yellow colouration between the black bands is a good indication of good body colour when they're older.
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
now they look like angels! Hope they carry on doing well
Akasha- Posts : 492
Join date : 2014-07-28
Age : 52
Location : Yorkshire, England
Re: Wish me luck!
They're coming along nicely and their stripes aren't broken. I'll assume you aren't raising them under constant light, unless you tell me otherwise. Very good, I'm sure they'll be amazing when they round up a bit. You can tell at this stage, they're going to have impressive fins, great pictures - thanks for sharing.
Re: Wish me luck!
Correct, lights are on for about 14 hours a day.I'll assume you aren't raising them under constant light
I certainly hope so.they're going to have impressive fins
Thanks!great pictures
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
Well it looks like I could find myself with more silver angels than I know what to do with!
The youngsters from the 1st Rio Nanay x 50% Manacapuru pair are are coming on nicely, and now a second pair have a big cloud of free swimmers
Personally I think this male is nicer than the father from the first pair....
....and I think the mother shows more of her Manacapuru heritage...
Add to that, no photos but, a third pair consisting of a third male Czech bred Rio Nanay & a wild caught female Rio Nanay whose eggs hatched into wrigglers today.
The youngsters from the 1st Rio Nanay x 50% Manacapuru pair are are coming on nicely, and now a second pair have a big cloud of free swimmers
Personally I think this male is nicer than the father from the first pair....
....and I think the mother shows more of her Manacapuru heritage...
Add to that, no photos but, a third pair consisting of a third male Czech bred Rio Nanay & a wild caught female Rio Nanay whose eggs hatched into wrigglers today.
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
Very nice, I bet they're a real joy. I could sit and watch those parenting for hours.
Re: Wish me luck!
wow ... I don't know how you cope with it all! Breeding is hard work and so I can't imagine having several fish all breeding. It's rewarding too, that much I also know. What do you do with all the young fish? You must have hundreds!
Akasha- Posts : 492
Join date : 2014-07-28
Age : 52
Location : Yorkshire, England
Re: Wish me luck!
It helps that I own a shop! But I think I may find myself rather over run with silvers, especially as the wild Nanay female & her mate seem to be doing a good job (their babies went free swimming this morning).....What do you do with all the young fish? You must have hundreds!
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
Re: Wish me luck!
of course I forgot about your shop! I hope all your babies find good homes
Akasha- Posts : 492
Join date : 2014-07-28
Age : 52
Location : Yorkshire, England
Re: Wish me luck!
Quick photo update :-
1st batch of "Manu Nanus", these are bold as brass, they always swim confidently at the front of their tank, with their fins erect and their black banding jet black..........
.....unless you point a camera at them!
Point a camera at them and they cower at the back, fins clamped and banding faded to nothing, so these were the best photos I could get, the red colouration is exaggerated compared to real life....
No such problems with the pure bred Rio Nanays. Encouragingly although there are just 16 survivors from this batch, all are showing good banding, unlike Dad. Anyway 16 is enough for me to be going on with.....
This second photo clearly shows the characteristic Nanay black mark at the base of the dorsal between the two body bands
The next photo is from my second batch of "Manu Nanus" which are a few days older than the pure bred Nanays. Although this next fish has faded out it's bands, it makes an interesting comparison with the fish above.
Notice how much thicker the bands are, once again, the photo does exaggerate the amount of red, in part because the water in their tank is stained with tanins from bogwood. None the less, their fins are redder, and their bodies do have more of a golden tint to them.
The older "Manu Nanus" are just starting to develop their dorsal striations, I'll be interested to see how these compare with the pure bred Nanays.
1st batch of "Manu Nanus", these are bold as brass, they always swim confidently at the front of their tank, with their fins erect and their black banding jet black..........
.....unless you point a camera at them!
Point a camera at them and they cower at the back, fins clamped and banding faded to nothing, so these were the best photos I could get, the red colouration is exaggerated compared to real life....
No such problems with the pure bred Rio Nanays. Encouragingly although there are just 16 survivors from this batch, all are showing good banding, unlike Dad. Anyway 16 is enough for me to be going on with.....
This second photo clearly shows the characteristic Nanay black mark at the base of the dorsal between the two body bands
The next photo is from my second batch of "Manu Nanus" which are a few days older than the pure bred Nanays. Although this next fish has faded out it's bands, it makes an interesting comparison with the fish above.
Notice how much thicker the bands are, once again, the photo does exaggerate the amount of red, in part because the water in their tank is stained with tanins from bogwood. None the less, their fins are redder, and their bodies do have more of a golden tint to them.
The older "Manu Nanus" are just starting to develop their dorsal striations, I'll be interested to see how these compare with the pure bred Nanays.
Pterophyllum- Posts : 1554
Join date : 2012-02-08
Location : Gloucestershire
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